O, Man, Class of 2019
Interview Transcription
(Filler words have been omitted)

Sharldine Desire: When did you start singing gospel music and why?
O: I’ve been singing gospel music for as long as I can remember. I was born in the church, my family sings…so that’s all I know. I was born singing.
SD: So did you like it right away—?
O: Yes.
SD: —and what about it kept your interest?
O: Well I grew up in the church, my father is a pastor, my uncles are pastors, my mother’s the first lady, my uncle was a Chaplin so gospel music has always been a part of my life. And for me, not only is it the music itself but the message that the music portrays and I can relate to it like if I’m going through something, I can listen to the music and know that they understand my struggle.
SD: Why did you join gospel choir here at Williams?
O: So back home I was in gospel choir and coming to Williams I knew that I wanted to find an environment where I could grow spiritually and still listen to the music I was accustomed to at home and be myself. I’m very goofy, I like to sing and play around I knew I wanted to find an outlet where that could be expressed.
SD: How do you think being in gospel choir has impacted your life here so far?
O: For me it’s a great help. For me, I want to make sure I am living a life that is pleasing to God and since I’m in gospel choir that means I am at the forefront of the school so I would not want to bring somebody down from my actions. For example, let’s say if I’m doing something I know I’m not supposed to be doing, if someone sees that and says “Hey, you’re in gospel choir! You’re up there singing this but you’re living a different life.” And I don’t want to be a hypocrite or live a double life so being in gospel choir helps me stay on the straight and narrow.
SD: How do you, or do you, interact with gospel music outside of the choir?
O: Oh, that’s all I listen to. I also—I write gospel music. I’ve written probably about over twenty songs—
SD: What?
O: Yeah, so I listen to, I’ve written, back home I directed gospel choir so…it’s part of my life.
SD: Okay, so what do you think is the difference between you sitting there writing songs, listening to songs, being all up in it and then learning and performing gospel music with the choir?
O: When I listen to it or write a song, it’s more personal. Like when I’m writing a song it’s either about something I’m going through or something that I have experienced, it’s me pouring my heart and soul into that song. Same for when I listen to it. If I’m feeling down or slightly depressed, I listen to the songs and it boosts me up. Whereas when you’re performing it, it’s still that same aspect but it’s a performance, which means you have to learn the songs. Your mind has to be focused on the song and making sure you learn your part because you can put all your heart and soul in it but if you’re singing the wrong note, it’s not going to sound right.
SD: So do you like the performance aspect of gospel choir?
O: Overall, I would say yes. Back home we didn’t call it a “performance,” we just sang in church but here I do like it…it’s different, but I like it.
SD: It’s different, how’s it different?
O: Well, back home it was more of a spiritual “performance” because we would say that we’ve done this but we’ll just let the Lord have his way [with the performance] and that was your mindset whereas here in our performance, the Lord can still have his way but this is our set agenda and we have to follow it.
SD: How do you think the students here read our performance of gospel music?
O: I think it’s a blessing. They may not realize it but it’s keeping them. Because you can see people’s faces light up, they’re happier, some say they were depressed but it has lifted their spirits up and that’s what gospel music is supposed to do. So if that’s what people say they are feeling based on our performance than we’re doing our job.
SD: So just take us back into black history, what role do you think gospel music has played in the past?
O: Gospel music was a way for African-Americans to tell their story and exemplify their struggle. For example, during slavery times we had the negro spirituals, it was a way for them to send messages to each other and also away to let others know “Hey, I know what you’re going through.” And throughout history, gospel music is supposed to spread the good news of Jesus Christ so I feel like in that aspect as well, it’s always portrayed the message.
SD: Do you think it still plays that same role in the black community today?
O: I think it does, overall. I mean not as many people are as “spiritual and religious” as they were in the past but gospel music is consistent. We might have all these trends here and there, you might have these music artists but gospel music is the one thing that’s going to be there, it’s like your foundation, you may not think about it but you know when you’re down and out, it’s that one thing you can go to. So I think it’s still in the black community like that…yeah.
SD: What role do you think it plays outside of the black community?
O: I feel it is a way for people who are not black to understand the struggle of people who are black and it’s also a way for them to hear the message of Jesus Christ, so it’s like a two-fold process.
SD: So tell me about your first concert, what was that like for you? Singing with the choir and then alone as a soloist…and what was it like seeing the audience’s reaction or if you were paying attention…kind of just that dynamic, tell me about it.
O: I loved it, when it was over I was like “It went by so quickly!” For me though, the very beginning when we were singing the Negro spirituals, I felt that the people who were not black in the choir truly put all their emotion and passion into the songs we were singing like “Ain’t Gonna Let Nobody Turn Me Around…”
SD: The people who weren’t black did?
O: Yes, I feel, as a whole—
SD: So they did or they didn’t?
O: They did not. Because I feel like that song, as an African-American, we know the struggle. We’ve seen it, we’ve heard it, and we’ve felt it, whereas for them it was like “Oh this is just a nice song with a nice stomping beat.” Same for “Oh Freedom.” If you listen to the words “before I be a slave, I’ll be buried in my grave and go home…” Like, as I was singing it, I was thinking to myself like “No, oh freedom. I want this freedom.” And same throughout the whole concert, for me, my goal was to make sure I put all my passion so that when people heard me sing they could tell that I believed what I was singing and that through my singing, they realize that I am being blessed as I am blessing them. So, when I sang my solo that was my mindset.
SD: So is there anything else you’d like to say about your experience here so far, with GC? What you’ve learned from being a part of it…anything?
O: Oh I love it; I just wish the choir were bigger because people do not know what they are missing. You have a family, you’re learning, it’s exciting, it’s fun…and you can’t beat that. Like for me, whenever I leave gospel choir, I’m always happy…so I’m grateful for it.

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A, Woman, Class of 2018
Interview Transcription
(Filler words such as “um” have been omitted)

Sharldine Desire: When did you first start singing gospel music and why?
A: Ever since I was young and I went to church at Brooklyn Tabernacle Choir. So for as long as I remember, I’ve never not heard gospel music.
SD: You’ve never not sung it either?
A: Yeah
SD: Did you like it right away? And what about it kept your interest?
A: Yes, it’s basically part of my culture, even though I am African, we do borrow from gospel in our own songs at the same time…we do sing that. So when we’d gather around to pray, before every prayer is praise. So we’d sing gospel songs—maybe we’d sing a gospel song and then we’d sing an African religious song…
SD: Yeah it’s very much the same for me, being Haitian. So why did you join gospel choir at Williams? What was your motivation for that?
A: That’s a great question. Part of the reason why I joined gospel choir—it was actually my default option…I tried out for Purple Rain and I didn’t get it so I decided to try gospel choir. I think one of your members referred me to it. But I think it was like a blessing in disguise in the sense that like where I am now, I can’t see myself even being part of another group because gospel choir has just become such an integral part of my being here at Williams. And also Naomi, whose a member, she sort of made me feel comfortable going there because I knew I’d have a friendly face.
SD: So going off that, how do you think being part of gospel choir has impacted your life here so far?
A: I think it’s definitely…the people I’ve met, they’ve definitely changed my views on a lot of things. I tell this to people at home, that gospel choir is like my family inside of Williams in the sense that like…I often find myself unable to have a space where I can be myself and just be free to discuss everything I want or just act goofy, make jokes…but when I’m at gospel choir, the atmosphere is just very welcoming, inviting and just carefree. It’s like that place that you know you’re definitely going to de-stress, and all the work that you’ve gone through, all the troubles that you’ve been through for that week, you just come there and you just unwind…
SD: How do you interact—or do you interact—with gospel music outside of the choir?
A: Yeah actually…like gospel choir coupled with a conversation I had with one of my friends sort of helped me shift spiritually, like a sort of spiritual growth. So that conversation plus being surrounded by Christ and people who want to be Christ-like has definitely changed me in many ways. For example, I don’t listen to secular music anymore, in fact all I listen to is gospel music and at times I find myself…that’s all I’m singing and some of the songs bring me to tears and I’m just like…this was not me prior to gospel choir and the people I’ve met prior to gospel choir.
SD: So what’s the difference, do you think, when you’re singing or listening to gospel music by yourself and when you’re learning a song or performing a song with GC?
A: When I’m listening or singing on my own it’s more personal, like it’s just me and God and at the point I’m very vulnerable cuz it’s just us, just me and God in that moment and I will sing with all my might unrestrained and it just hits closer to home. I’ll listen to the lyrics and not just listen to it but also apply it to my life. It becomes a part of me. But with GC it take a while with that only because of the structure and you definitely need structure because it’s a gospel choir, but that’s just the difference because when you’re in GC you’re trying to learn a song and do the song justice by fulfilling every component, whether you’re a alto, tenor, soprano or a bass. So in GC I’m basically singing the words but there’s no meaning after until I take those songs to my room and I sing them and I start really feeling it.
SD: Good, so do you enjoy the performance aspect of GC?
A: Definitely…after our first concert I received a lot of feedback about our performance in general and how it touched a lot of people who were not necessarily spiritual and they said that it really made them reconsider that. It’s just being able to directly be a tool used by God to impact people. If God gives you a talent, you better use it and by you using it, it’s helping in his overall and general will.
SD: So kind of related to that, if you want to say anything more—how do you think it’s read here at Williams? How do you think gospel music and our performing it is read or understood?
A: From my understanding, our generation or our group, our gospel choir group is different from anything Williams has seen. I mean there’s been gospel choir since I don’t know when but we’re definitely not the first. We have freshmen who came in, we have just new people but after Mountain Day, a lot of people said that they were really with it because of our rendition of “This Little Light of Mine” and “Go Tell It.” It was more of a contemporary rendition and it wasn’t all like…I don’t know, normally gospel music has a tendency to be overpowering and people often feel uncomfortable because maybe they don’t understand it but we perform our songs, and even on Mountain Day, in a way that’s more relatable to students.
SD: What role do you think gospel music has played throughout history in the black community?
A: I think gospel music in general, the whole merit of it is that it got black people, oppressed people through the hard times. And even in the songs, when you listen to the lyrics, it’s the desperation of a group of people who have been oppressed and they’re conveying that desperation into words. So the power that is exuded through those lyrics, it’s just something phenomenal in the sense that you have this group of people that were oppressed but were still able to create this beautiful art so it’s just a true testament to that group of people.
SD: So do you think it still plays that role in the black community today?
A: Um…I think we’re definitely in a different time. We don’t sing the “Oh Freedom” or the Negro spirituals as much because we’re not in that time period per se. I feel like gospel music now is meant to sustain your faith and it’s meant to also help recruit and evangelize, where as gospel music in the past was meant to get people through a hard time.
SD: But for you, doesn’t it still do that?
A: Get me through hard times? Absolutely. It’s just something that I know. Each song is different and there are also different songs that cater to my situation. For instance, when I’m feeling down I’ll listen to “My God is Awesome” and know that he is great. I can listen to “Take Me To The King” and know that other people have struggled the way I’ve struggled and they found God and sought God to get them through it.
SD: How about outside of the black community? So it seems that even for you here at Williams, for people going through their own struggles in the modern time, gospel is still that thing that keeps them going in a lot of ways, but do you think that it does the same thing outside of the black community? Do you think that it has a similar effect on other groups of people?
A: Like white people?
SD: White people, other people…
A: Um…no, because it’s not in their history. It’s a part of black history, it was created by blacks…so you know, I can’t speak for all white people but I feel like a white person can listen to the same gospel song that a black person is listening to and take the lyrics and the words at face value and be like “Oh it’s a catchy tune” but they don’t really understand the gravity of the words, whereas a black person may appreciate it more because the art is just so purely rooted in what a black person’s history has come from. So I don’t think—like for instance, there were some songs performed by gospel choir where it was a struggle because the choir is generally mixed, which is great, but at the same time you had—I noticed that the African-American or black students in the group, they would sing the song with all their might and their power but the non-blacks in the group, they didn’t necessarily convey the passion and emotion behind the words. It seems like just words to them, while an African American student will actually feel the words.
SD: Okay, so those are all the official questions but I kind of just wanted to hear a little but about—and you spoke to it, definitely—but your personal experience at the concert. Like the audience and what it was like for you, this was your first concert and the first thing that had our name on it, so what was it like for you on stage?
A: Prior to gospel choir, I never really sang in public or never really sang at all because I’ve had a couple bad experiences with that and I never really got any good feedback so my confidence with that was really low but with building it with gospel choir and growing as a singer, a vocalist—it was just nice to see that a lot of people had good feedback on my performance and the whole entire performance in general. I didn’t realize how your voice could be a tool, like I said before, for God, and that my voice could be a tool and that I could help with that overall agenda. I think gospel choir, that performance, definitely reassured me that I can do it and that this is something I want to continue doing. But I was definitely surprised at myself for being able to do that because right before I was extremely, extremely nervous and I don’t really have a lot of confidence in it but afterwards, the feedback I got definitely reassured me that I’m in the right place.
SD: And how important do you think the audience is…and their reaction? Like how important was it for you that they reciprocated?
A: Well when I’m performing I try not to look at the audience because it just makes me nervous but I noticed when other people were performing the looks on their faces—it was a look that I’ve seen before, only because gospel choir performed earlier in the year at a church that’s like 30 minutes away from here and the church is definitely not a “black church,” it’s very structured and they sing the hymns, it’s definitely nothing that I was used to and definitely far from Baptist, Lutheran type churches that I’ve seen so when we sang our songs and everyone—their eyes opened and people were getting out of their seat and people were getting their phones out because I could tell that they had never been exposed to gospel music and the beauty of it and how pure and great gospel music can be. And I think we got that same reaction at the concert in the sense that people didn’t understand—like it’s one thing to hear gospel music, it’s another thing to see it performed. And when you see it performed and the acoustics are just right and it just fills the whole room…it has the propensity to invite the Holy Spirit in and I think that that’s what a lot of people were feeling, they just didn’t know what it was. That feeling where they just can’t put their thumb on it, there’s just something there. And one thing that I kept hearing was that this performance gave them chills, what is that chill? They don’t know what that chill is but they know that it gave them chills…

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Q, Woman, Class of 2019
Interview Transcript
(Excessive filler words such as “um,” “like,” and “you know” have been omitted)

Sharldine Desire: So, when did you first start singing gospel music and why?
Q: Honestly, I didn’t start singing gospel music seriously until I got here. My mom was a worship leader at our old church but our old church was like really tiny so…I don’t know, it was weird, I never really had the full “black church,” huge thing experience.
SD: When you started singing it seriously here, did you like it right away?
Q: Yes.
SD: What kept your interest? Like what about it kept your interest?
Q: Just like memories of growing up and using my voice for something I’ve always enjoyed and just feeling more connected to it. Like my life has been two different extremes, like when I was growing up it was all church all the time and there wasn’t really a choice and then when I got older and I started to separate from the church a little bit but I still felt strongly about my belief in Jesus and God…but then al my friends didn’t have religion in their lives, so it was like two extremes. But here I finally like—gospel music gave me that balance. Just participating with other people who feel how I do to an extent and aren’t like…crazy, you know what I mean. Like crazy old people who are just trying to control you, they’re just regular people that are your age and that was like a new experience for me in that I didn’t know how much I wanted that in my life until I got here.
SD: Good, so…you found out that Gospel Choir was that but what made you want to join in the first place?
Q: Ya’ll didn’t have auditions and I just wanted to sing [laughs]
SD: No, that’s actually so real. That’s actually why so many people come and then they realize we’re amazing and then they stay.
Q: Yeah basically…and I’m really glad I did because all the stuff I auditioned for I didn’t get into so it was like a good…not really a fallback but like a good anchor to know that no matter what happens I’ll still be able to sing.
SD: So how do you think it’s impacted your life here so far?
Q: It has kind of given me…like a group I belong to and an identity here. And I feel like at Williams everyone stresses like having an identity and having a group so much so it helped assimilate me into this new place that is very different from home.
SD: How, if applicable, do you interact with gospel music outside of the choir?
Q: I listen to it a lot when I’m doing homework or when I need strength. I’ll put some gospel music on in the background and hope that it motivates me. It’s kind of my way of communicating to God without always having to get on my knees and pray and set aside time for that. It’s kind of like my way of showing him that I’m always thinking of him and it’s also comforting for me as well.
SD: So what do you think is the difference between listening to and singing gospel music on your own and learning a song to perform with GC?
Q: Umm…can you rephrase that?
SD: Sure…like I guess for me, when I’m like in my gospel zone or in the middle of one of my praise sessions verses when I’m like teaching the choir or singing with the choir…it sometimes just feels different for me, not necessarily in a good way or a bad way…just different. Does it feel different for you and how?
Q: Hmm I don’t know…like I said before…for me Christianity was kind of like this thing that was for old people because I was the only kid in my church so I don’t know when I listen to it alone…at first I used to think that I was the only one of my age that listened to that stuff but when I sing with the choir it reminds me that I’m not alone and that there are all different types of people who appreciate this music for worship or just because they like the energy or other stuff. So I guess it just gives me…like I have more perspective when I’m singing it with the choir than when I listen to it alone.
SD: Do you like performing gospel music with GC?
Q: Yes…
SD: How do you think it is read here at Williams, like the performance of it?
Q: Hmmm I don’t know. That’s a good question. It’s always interesting to know how people connect with it. Because gospel music, especially modern gospel music, is just so catchy and upbeat…it’s hard not to like it, whether you’re like an atheist or whatever branch of religion you fall under. It’s just pleasant to the ear…so I feel like at Williams it can be kind of be like that, just really nice to listen to. I think that maybe other people might think of it more like a culture…like if I was to go watch that…what’s that dance group? They dance to Spanish music?
SD: Ritmo? Ritmo Latino?
Q: Yeah, like if I watch them, I see it as entertainment but also a cultural thing, like experiencing a different culture and I think Williams [students] see it the same way. Even if they don’t believe in it, they’re experiencing a different type of culture.
SD: Nice, um…what role do you think gospel music has played throughout history within the black community?
Q: I think it’s just been a really big integral part of a lot of people’s upbringing, like upbringing throughout generations. With our concert, it was Gospel Through The Times, before gospel used to be like simple Negro spirituals…it was a means of communication while still showing your faith in God. I feel like that’s carried out throughout the black community. You know maybe not as intensely as trying to escape from slavery but I think it’s still a big part of how we keep our faith in the face of adversity and everything you have to go through in America with being black and stuff.
SD: I guess you already kind of answered this but if you want to speak more to it…do you still think it plays that same role today? Do you think gospel music impacts the black community in the same way?
Q: I don’t know, it’s hard to say because now…since so much has changed—well a good amount of things have changed—people have like this choice of whether they want to be a part of that culture or not. Where as before it wasn’t a choice but like a means of survival. So I think it’s changed in that way and in that way it also becomes more fun and enjoyable and it doesn’t always have to be so intense, even though it’s still very intense in some churches. I think there’s like different places on spectrum now. Gospel music can be fun and just nice to listen to and it can go to the same intensity as it was throughout history.
SD: And how about outside the community? Like gospel music like a lot of black music and black culture has kind of like gone past black people and moved into the mainstream and had gotten musical influences from other types of music styles…so do you think gospel music speaks to people outside the religious black community?
Q: I’m not really sure. It’s hard to say…like gospel music down south in black churches is a huge thing and it’s a huge thing that I think is very contained. Like I don’t think many people from other cultures are that affected by it. And I don’t know if it been assimilated into like cultural appropriation like rap music or any of the stuff we’re dealing with now. I don’t think gospel music has gotten to that point yet but it’s hard to say because, again, I have a very limited view of gospel myself.
SD: So those are all the questions but do you have anything more you want to say maybe about your experience in the choir or the concert, what was it like for you? It was your first one…so how was that, the response of the audience and everything?
Q: Like how it is with the choir in general…I think, it’s very interesting…the kind of people who are in the choir. We’re the most diverse singing groups, I’d argue, on campus. And especially with a cappella, they have the same type of people, they have their own kind of culture and their own kind of feel. When you say their name you think of “X” type of person but I feel like you can’t do that when people say “Williams Gospel Choir,” you can’t distinct like “black girl” or “black man” because that’s not the only people who are in it. You have TAs from around the world; you have people who’ve graduated who are still a part of it and then different people on the spectrum who are at Williams now so I don’t know. I think it says a lot that we attract all different types of people and I think it gives the choir a very welcoming appeal. And when I hear people talk about us they’re like “you guys definitely look like you have the most fun on stage than any other group” and stuff like that and I couldn’t really not agree because we obviously do [laughs]. So the concert yeah…it was definitely an experience. It was nice seeing all these people come out. Some people you see may surprise you and then some people you thought would be there but weren’t there for whatever reason. So you focus so much on the crowd in the beginning, like who came and who didn’t come, but the deeper you get into it the more it’s like about you and your experience with the music than it is about who came and who didn’t come.

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